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tolik
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Riga, Latvia
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 Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Hey, OGL is "dead" for mass products. It's still a thing for high profile products, but what's the reason to learn something that is used by ten products per year and couldn't be used for anything else?
On Java VS Flash.
Flash WAS created for games starting from version 7. There are multiplayer games, single player games, MMOs... All inside browser without extra installation.
Flash IS crossplatform - there's FP9 for Win, Mac, Linux.
Flash Lite 2.0 is installed on most N-series from Nokia and other phones like 6233 and of course for other manufacturers.
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Kamazs
Guru
Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 829
Location: The glorious ancient city of Loja
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| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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No arguing about how Flash is great and nice, but still, I dont get it --
OGL is dead? There are no games in OGL?
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...un es uzskatu, ka Fallout ir etalons |
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bubu
Indago Uzvarētājs
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Posts: 3223
Location: Riga
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| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, there is no Quake 4, there is no Quake Wars, there is no World of Warcraft, and there is no PlayStation 3, and there will not be mobile games using OpenGL ES.
And even not mentioning Indie games... |
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tolik
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Riga, Latvia
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| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:11 am Post subject: |
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Flash is great and nice!
OGL is great and nice, but useless 
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anggelus
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 383
Location: Rīga (LV)
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| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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Probably useless and dead for you but not for all those developers which are still writing great games using OGL.
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elvman
Indago Uzvarētājs
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 1278
Location: Kuldiga
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| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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Nu pag veči. OGL is dead? A interesanti, kā flash renderē 3D uz non-windows platformām?
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long time; /* know C */ |
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bubu
Indago Uzvarētājs
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Posts: 3223
Location: Riga
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| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Tūlīt tu dabūsi tekstu, ka arī non-windows platformas ir dead un useless. |
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Storm
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 742
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| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:58 pm Post subject: |
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| anggelus wrote: | | Probably useless and dead for you but not for all those developers which are still writing great games using OGL. |
Tiesi taa - still - taatad veeljoprojaam raksta, bet kaa ir ar jauno paaudzi? ;D |
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tolik
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Riga, Latvia
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| Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:44 am Post subject: |
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| elvman wrote: | | Nu pag veči. OGL is dead? A interesanti, kā flash renderē 3D uz non-windows platformām? |
Flash = 100% software rendering
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bubu
Indago Uzvarētājs
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Posts: 3223
Location: Riga
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| Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 2:20 am Post subject: |
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Tieši par 3D renderēšanu flašā neko nezinu, bet hardwares akselerāciju vismaz uz MacOSX tas izmanto gan.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Flash
| Quote: | | Adobe has rewritten the bitmap drawing routines in Flash Player 8 for Mac, using OpenGL planes via Quartz to draw the surfaces. The new drawing code is reported to be actually faster than its Windows counterpart |
Why does Flash Player 8 on Mac perform so much better?
| Quote: | | So, in essence it means that the Flash Player will use OpenGL on OS X 10.2 or newer to display its content if the machine meets the requirements |
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snake5
Indago dalībnieks
Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 2590
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| Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:34 am Post subject: |
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software renderings nav labs, nemaz.. tur ir smaga izvēle starp puslīdz normālu grafiku, vai ātru, bet nenormāli neprecīzu.. kāds paņem aplūkot irrlicht software renderētājus - pašu veidoto un to otru.. viss būs skaidrs..
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elvman
Indago Uzvarētājs
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 1278
Location: Kuldiga
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| Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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Bet kas tad bija tas, ko mums rādīja Indago prezentācijā? Tās 3D flash figņās? Visi tie smakie efekti? Kādā veidā tad to var pavilkt (ar tādu FPS kā prfezentācijā) software rendereris?
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tolik
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Riga, Latvia
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| Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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All links for what was shown at Indago are included in first post.
"3D flash figņās" = software engine.
| Quote: |
bet hardwares akselerāciju vismaz uz MacOSX tas izmanto gan
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"bitmap drawing routines" = blit.
MacOSX uses OGL for everything. You can't have something that doesn't use OGL, as it still ends up blitting to screen through OGL. If some basic stuff like MovieClip and Curve get accelerated through OGL, that doesn't mean anything as most of the stuff in Flash nowadays doesn't use static movieclips or pictures, it gets distorted on "pixel shader" level through framebuffer, so basically only old pre-generated Flash could be accelerated.
Vista uses DX for all the cool effects as well, so NO, FLASH IS NOT HW ACCELERATED ON MACOSX.
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gazz
Joined: 03 Jan 2004
Posts: 355
Location: Teika
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| Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| sheit es tomeer nostajos tolik pusee, jo cik es atminos tad vinsh ir viens no retajiem cilveekiem Latvijaa kas ar speeleem pelna sev iztiku un ikdienaa meklee risinaajums kaa vienkaarshaak un aatraak uztaisiit speeles kuras vareetu paardot un ieguut liidzekljus savas tehnologjijas un prasmju attiistiibai. paaris gadus atpakalj directx un opengl bija veids kaa radiit speeles, bet tehnologjias attiistaas tik aatri ka ir jaavelta ljoti ilgs laiks lai nokjertu liimeni ar shiim tehnologjijaam. es nesaku ka taas ir novecojushas, bet iesaaceejiem labaak saakt ar lietaam, ko var dabuut up & running peec iespeejas iisaakaa periodaa & saakt mekleet advanceetaakas lietas tikai tad kad rodas peec taadaam nepiecieshamiiba, nevis lekt uzreiz aizaa cerot ka sanaaks kaut kas. es uzskatu ka nevaig akli noniecinaat profesionaalja viedokli deelj hobija liimenja pieredzes. tas tomeer ir bizness ar konkurenci 2 centi |
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snake5
Indago dalībnieks
Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 2590
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| Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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| gazz wrote: | | nevis lekt uzreiz aizaa cerot ka sanaaks kaut kas |
nu vai zini, ka neko nezini?
es pats kādas reizes 5 lecu aizā ar Payback Hour, viena no tām - bez backupa konvertēt spēli tā, lai tā lieto manu d3d9 wrapperi, nākamā - izmest visu veco personāžu rendera kodu, un likt iekšā skinnedmesh'u murgaini no samples pārbīdīto kodu..
un, kā redzi, viss izdevās!
secini pats... galvenais ir gribēt, nevis izmantot ātrās & vienkāršās & maziespēju tehnoloģijas dēļ spēles veidošanas ātruma..
tas var smagi atsaukties tad, kad spēle būs jāpārveido labākā līmenī...
mūsdienās ir tomēr tā, ka spēlētāji tomēr nenormāli vērtē grafiku, pat tuvu gameplay'am! |
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